A classic map. Excellent gameplay for a 1v1.

i know what uv missed on this map. As good as 3a 1a 22 aso, imao obviously. Try killing someone real, not bots there.. heh. someone real....

Very good map with Very good Gameplay :).

very nice indeed good size map looks nice plays good overall a great map hehe......... :)

So, i must tell that i only play q3 in cpm ans I play some game against bots on cpm8... I think it's a very good map for cpm.

Because of the big separation between ya and mega+rail. The gameplay is speedier than the other cpm map (duel) and the fight are : Very short or tactical... And the cpm physics are also a good help for increase the speed of gameplay...

Thanks jude for this enjoyable map, but i prefer cpm3...

shambler, it's supposed to :)

it's not promode!, ie no aircontrol :)

Hi Auhsan =). Yeah you can jump from the closer side ledge on one side of the stair case to the MH, without changing any variables, but it's a bit annoying as the bloody corner gets in the way...

Hubster.. not all... i'm not 100% happy with this map while others might be :/ While i (like most people) will accept praise without question, your comments were probably the closest to what i was really thinking (except for the huge drop in standards bit.. drop in standards yes, but not huge :])..

As for something big coming up.. well, thats a definate maybe, but v1.0 promode is very very close :)

Very bluish and spacy map! Good for rocketfighting and that sort of stuff and enough large map for big matches indeed. But there is something missing. Don't know what it is. Get that a lot ;) Don't let it get you down. Keep up the good work! :) I do believe there is something big coming on...

C-Man: uhm?what?

Very nice map +7

Aussie +2

=]

Oh and I must add...

Its great having a Geforce isnt it? Three months of having great FPS, and I'm still not over it:-)

Re: Jude

I hope that my comments were not too harsh, Jude. Blunt speaking is a bad/good trait I have :-)

I do stand with what I said tho. I can also understand though, and as a fellow mapper, that dealing with new mapping concepts aint a walk in the park. From having Q2 standards for soo long, and then jumping up to curves, caulk, and thinking so much more about gaps etc etc, its a harder task (even though, an enjoyable one).

For your first true curvey effort, you HAVE done well.

I spose, as someone who thrashes your maps more than any other author's, I just have ereally high expectations.

I have no doubt that with more learning of the new concepts, you'll fill such expectations and beyond:-)

The Hubster

yup, there's always something wrong with my maps :)

bots.. well, tbh i couldnt care less how bots play on my maps... the bots in Q3 are terrible.. it's like playing someone who just went and bought the game an hour before and uses a combination of steering wheel and keyboard to move, yet is using a zbot.

as for the r_speeds yes i know they are a little high, and i was conscience of them even while i was building them. It's my first attempt at a map with curves (my editor only just gained the curves support) so i am still learning. Tigger is also helping me out with hint brushes and so forth.. Late on during the map build i learned how useful the caulk texture can be and i did use it to some effect, but obviously not enough :) For those interested, i am using a 566Celeron @ 866 with a v3, and i use r_picmip 0/lightmap so i do notice the frame drops.

On gameplay - i didnt think this map will play that well as a duel map even though really thats what it's geared towards. The people from Challenge World will be soon (read: i dont know exactly) be releasing CPMA (Challenge Promode Arena), ie.. Rocket arena Promode style. And this map will be one of the arenas included. I may change it, i might not, but i did build it with that in mind, so i apologise if it feels very ra3 :/. Duel and ra3 is a very hard combination to get right :)

The jump i put in hopefully this will enourage people to give CPM a try - if you find normal q3 more enjoyable so be it.. getting this jump right without a strafe jump first up is a nice feeling :)

Thanks for all the comments too,

i must be honest... even hubster's words were pretty close to my thoughts..

ps. i just went and bought a DDR geforce :D

I thought this map rocks with 4 players. The lighting is subtle yet effective but I thought the texturing was a little "subdued". Wicked map for a good brawl.

I played the map with D00M and the fucking bot is rjumping all the time to get MH. I can get it!

the map plays very well. there's a lot of railing and strategic play in it.

BTW, I can Jump to the Mh in normal quake from the stairs behind it but I was playing with /g_speed 400, so I suposs that doesnt count =)

The problem is that lots of triangles that arent seen without r_drawtris 1 are drawn whenever you stand on either side and looks towards the rest of the map. The number of triangels drawn could have been lessened by atleast 5-10% with a proper use of hint brushes, and by far more with some more vis-blocking architecture

sham: they are talking about CPM mod. they arent possible in normal q3a.

Hubster: The r_speeds in this map are higher because jude has put more detail than his others maps. if he has put more detail in their other maps their r_speeds would be high (q3jdm9 mainly)

Hmmm what do you mean by a double jump?? I assumed proper Q2 style double jumps weren't possible in Q3A yet here people are again talking about double jumps...

For a map by jude, whos every q3 level has rocked, I was quite suprised by this one. I personally feel that its a big drop in standard. The scaling is big, and the r_speeds are shocking. I'm not running a piece of crap for a system either, PIII 600, 128Mb and a Geforce DDR which gives me 90fps at 1024 X 32BBP.

The level has some cool concepts to it, and does make a good duel stage, but I still feel its a drop in standard for Jude.

7/10 from me. Lets hope his next offering is something back to the royal standards that Q3JDM8A achieved.

Sometimes I attack them too, but the trouble is that when I do that I annoy them and then they shoot me - I lose no end of frags that way!

Dagwit (and others) - I think I know now why I didn't see the bots go for the 100h/RG - i was camping it, or at the other end of the level. As Dagwit points out, bots don't RJump if you attack them, and well, I guess I must have been :]

I thought I'd do a test on bots rocketjumping to the megahealth/railgun platform, so I set up a tourney game between Doom and Gorre: I ran three games each at Hurt Me Plenty and Nightmare, fifteen minutes a game and no frag limit (no, I don't have that much time to waste, I used devmap and timescale). I spectated the MH/railgun platform and noted what happened. The bots jumped 18 times over three games on NM and 15 times on HMP. Being reluctant to awaken my old stats textbooks from decades of peaceful slumber, I can't say whether or not this difference is statistically significant. But it clearly isn't a matter of bots RJing much more at one level of difficulty than another.

By the way, Doom jumped 21 times and Gorre twelve. Now there's a parameter CHARACTERISTIC_WEAPONJUMPING in the botfiles that I would guess controls rocket jumping: interestingly, it's 1 for Gorre and only .5 for Doom. On the other hand, FS-HEALTH is 2 for Doom but only 1 for Gorre, while W_RAILGUN IS 450 for Doom and 185 for Gorre. It looks as though Doom just plain wants those items more than Gorre.

What little I know about the bot files I learned from:
'Kirin's Q3A-Bot Troubleshooter and Tutorial' (galacticamoon.simp..._q3abot00.shtml)

This site is aimed at dispensing enough information to enable you to write your own botfile. If anyone knows a site where the botfiles and bot behaviour generally are discussed in more detail, perhaps Tigger-oN and Mandog could spare a line in this thread for the URL.

Two other points: I never saw a bot reach the platform without RJing, so they clearly haven't found any fancy jumps.

And I think I know now why I've never actually seen a bot RJ before (in fact, I never actually saw one RJ while playing CPM8; I just inferred it from seeing a bot on the MH/railgun platform etc.). I noticed that as soon as a bot detected the opposition, it would break off the RJ maneouvre: even if it had successfully reached the platform and was barely a GU from the megahealth or railgun, it'd turn round and engage. So by the time I see a bot that's been thinking about RJing, it's heard me coming and has given up on the RJ.

I obviously don't sneak around enough (or play CPM).

Yet again jude delivers.

Well done mate :)

This rocks

What Uusvali was to Quake/2, Jude is to Q3A. This rocks in CPM. now I'm gonna go look for some information you don't know... =)

one problem with bots in a FFA,you can tend to sit in a corner and just rail away for ages and they never seem to go for you that much.dont kno why i mentioned this here as its about a tourney map>?

Oi dude, you're too freakin' fast... I was just starting to think "guess it's time to round up my beta thoughts for Jude" and here you've already released the damn thing. :-)

Bots (on nightmare skill) often RJump, sometime for no real reason at all, maybe it was just the bots I was using that didn't go for the 100h/RG when i was testing. BTW, there are a few different ways to get the 100h/RG in both CPM and standard Q3A that do not envolve a RJump.

I was playing this last night (downloaded it from FxR|jude's own site) and in a one-on-one against Doom saw or heard him pick up he MH/rail a good few times. I'm pretty sure he was RJing too - though the bots are supposed to be able to do this, this is the first time in hundreds of hours of play I've had any hint of a bot actually doing so.